"Crossing Euphrates"

On that day Jehovah concluded with Abram a covenant, saying: “To your seed I will give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the river Euphrates." -- Genesis 15:18


According to the Bible, Jehovah provided much needed INSPIRED LEADERSHIP in the first century and in ancient times (like in the days of Moses), and yet are we to believe He refuses to see the need of providing it in our day and time??? Does this make sense to you? Does this seem consistent to you? (See John 16:13, 14)
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:10 pm 
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Putting "Faith In" Or Attributing "Salvation To" An Organization -- Is It Scriptural???

Hi all,

... I was just wondering ...

I remember back when I was very active among the Jehovah's Witnesses, the Watchtower Society recommended a special procedure they used to press upon bible studies of Jehovah's Witnesses and direct them to the organization, called "directing attention to the organization." This was to be done in field service, at the end of the bible study, for about ten minues or so. You were supposed to bring some brochure or literature that spoke of the organization, or you could talk about meeting times, topics at the meetings, etc. Maybe some of you remember this "added" procedure.

Well, back then I used to wonder, 'why are they telling us to do this?'

Anyway, the idea never caught on with me. I just could not get into the hang of it for some reason. Which leads me to this question,

Should Jehovah's Witnesses proudly "put faith in" and/or shamelessly tell the world they attribute actual "salvation" to their organization? Isn't that something we (Jehovah's Witnesses) should be ashamed of even saying openly to the public?

Here are a couple of examples:

The cover of the March 1st, 1979 Watchtower magazine boldly proclaims,

“Put Faith in a Victorious Organization!”

Then too, the accompanying article repeatedly drives home the theme of having faith in the organization by saying:

“Faith in Jehovah’s theocratic organization... Did the remnant of spiritual Israelites and their theocratic companions, the ‘great crowd’ of Christ’s ‘other sheep,’ have such victorious faith? Yes!... Witnesses have kept their faith in Jehovah’s organization.” (p 18)

The article poses the question, “Is there any cause for us to lose faith in Jehovah’s visible organization...?” The answer is given, “Absolutely Not!... Our unwavering faith will be rewarded with victory and the crown of life.”

Did you get that?

The Watchtower Society teaches that Faith in the Organization will be rewarded with eternal life!

The same was stated in the November 15th, 1981 Watchtower magazine, p 21, where it says,

“Come to Jehovah’s Organization for Salvation”

That's right. We can get "Salvation" not from Jehovah God...not from Jesus Christ, but from Jehovah's Organization!!! (Please compare Rev. 7:10)

Did you know this???

And of course, it is clear from the literature of the Watchtower Society, that when they say “Jehovah’s organization” they mean the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of Brooklyn, NY. Under the Watchtower Society's insidious indoctrination, faith in God and His Son Jesus Christ becomes faith in the Watchtower Organization. (Please contrast John 14:1 to what the Watchtower Teaches on this point.)

Doesn't this mean, Jehovah's Witnesses are wickedly advocating "putting faith in" the Jehovah's Witnesses Organization and worse, shamelessly attributing actual "Salvation" to the Jehovah's Witnesses Organization? (And, they seem to be proud and very happy to tell you all about this. They even give it a special name: "directing attention to the organization")

Is that who Revelation 7:10 says we "owe salvation" to?

How do Jehovah's Witnesses justify such a stand? Doesn't this whole "WORSHIP-THE-ORGANIZATION" type of attitude they (Watchtower Society) push, strike you as blatantly wicked?


It has been noted that even in recent years, the Watchtower Society has been quick to point out the sin of idolatry in other religions. For instance this comment:

“Swayed by sensational oratory, some pour their hard-earned money into the pockets of TV evangelists in wholehearted support that amounts to devotion.” (See Watchtower March 1st, 1995, page 9.)

Given the Watchtower Society's stance on how all Jehovah's Witnesses should view their leadership, doesn't this come across quite hypocritical to you???

However, notice this emphatic statement on how all Jehovah's Witnesses should view their dedication before Jehovah.

It was clearly stated:

“A Christian therefore, cannot be baptized in the name of the one actually doing the immersing or in the name of any man, nor in the name of ANY ORGANIZATION, but in the name of the Father, the Son and the holy spirit.” — July 1st, 1955 Watchtower pg. 411 par. 15.

…Or this quote which says the same thing,

“Jehovah is the giver of life. ‘For with you is the source of life.’ (Ps. 36:9) We cannot keep everlasting life in view without staying CLOSE TO JEHOVAH, the source of life … This is what we mean when we dedicate our lives to Jehovah. We DO NOT DEDICATE OURSELVES TO A RELIGION, nor to a man, nor to AN ORGANIZATION. No, we dedicate ourselves to the Supreme Sovereign of the Universe, our Creator, Jehovah God himself. This makes dedication a VERY PERSONAL RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN US AND JEHOVAH. For this reason, all dedicated ones are not only privileged but obligated to draw near to Jehovah in prayer. James 4:8 tells us: ‘Draw close to God, and he will draw close to you.” — October 1st, 1966 Watchtower pages 603, 604 paragraphs 14, 15

Additionally, the questions for that particular study article paragraph, to re-emphasize the point was:

“What principles must we keep clearly in mind in our relationship to Jehovah? What should we know about dedication? What necessary thing will help us to stay close to Jehovah, keeping him always before?

So then, why am I bringing up these quotes from yesteryear publications?

Well, consider this. What about the earth-shaking changes and adjustments, made to our baptismal, dedication questions of recent years? What about those baptismal questions that are propounded to all new baptismal candidates world wide, as of the summer of 1985. Questions, from the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses. These questions are:

1) On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?

2) Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in ASSOCIATION WITH GOD’S SPIRIT-DIRECTED ORGANIZATION? (See June 1st, 1985 Watchtower pg. 30 paragraphs 3 &4.)

In case your are wondering, before that time, (before 1985) the dedication questions for all baptismal candidates were simply,

1) Have you recognized yourself as a sinner and needing salvation from Jehovah God? And have you acknowledged that this salvation proceeds from him and through his ransomer, Christ Jesus?

2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for redemption have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to Jehovah God, to do his will henceforth as that will is revealed to you through Christ Jesus and through God’s Word as his Holy Spirit makes it plain? (See 1970 Watchtower pg. 309 paragraph 20.)

So, according to the original purpose exhibited in the use of the original questions, the 1966 Watchtower magazine reminds us that we must always keep in mind, our dedication brings us “close to Jehovah,” and we must always stay close to Jehovah, Jesus Christ, and the bible which is the product of God’s Holy Spirit. Therefore according to my dedication, the bible then & now, is the LAST WORD to me, and ultimate determining factor, on all doctrinal matters and becomes the genuine foundation of my religious belief system, or of any persuasion of religious belief, that I personally hold to God Almighty, Jehovah, and His heavenly enthroned, “only-begotten” Son & King, Jesus. — 2 Tim. 3:16, 17

However, just so we don't get confused about the REAL INTENT of the recent change given to the new set of baptismal questions, the Watchtower Society spells it out for us by saying in April 15th, 1987 issue, page 15:

(W87 4/15 pg. 15 – Gaining Peace With God Through Dedication and Baptism – under the Footnotes)

  • “Recently the two questions addressed to baptismal candidates were simplified so that candidates could answer with full comprehension of what is involved in coming into intimate relationship with God and his earthly organization.”

Now ask yourself:

  • Isn't this a 180 degree turnaround, the exact opposite, from what the Watchtower magazine under President Nathan Knorr and Vice President Frederick Franz said back in 1966, as cited above??? -- Please review October 1st, 1966 Watchtower pages 603, 604 paragraphs 14, 15.

Is this supposed to be "New Light" from the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses?

Are they actually making "improvements" upon the original baptismal questions themselves?

Or, have they [Governing Body] taken a very dangerous turn, at this critical point?

Think about it!

And additionally did they say, we should come into an "intimate relationship" with an impersonal "organization"??? How can a living, breathing person, do that?

And that is not all.

Just recently, in the July 15th, 2013 Watchtower article on "Who Really Is The Faithful Slave And Discreet Slave?" this insidious statement was made, concerning whether a person could have a quote, "healthy spiritual relationship with Jehovah" ... without having one with the Governing Body:

Comment found in paragraph #2.

  • ... That faithful slave is the channel through which Jesus is feeding his true followers in this time of the end. It is vital that we recognize the faithful slave. Our spiritual health and our relationship with God depend on this channel.—Matt. 4:4; John 17:3.

In other words, your personal relationship with Jehovah, completely depends on your having a close relationship with the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses.

Did you know this? Maybe all Jehovah's Witnesses baptized before 1985, did not know this, actually. Yes, this is a new point for all to consider.

Let's mention that point again because of its great importance.

This means of course, you personally cannot have a "healthy," yes that's "healthy," spiritual "relationship with Jehovah," without...without the Governing Body [representing the "spirit-directed" organization, being the main or leading part of it]. And that's the real reason for the big change in the baptismal questions all the way back to the summer of 1985. Its all about getting [or stealing] "glory" for themselves, plain and simple. Its about stealing from Jehovah God! Remember, first [back in 1985] we needed a close, "intimate relationship" with the "spirit-directed Organization." But nowadays, a few years later, you need more specifically, a close, "healthy, spiritual relationship" with the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses...before you can have one with Jehovah. -- See Exodus 20:3; Isaiah 42:8; Ezekiel 43:8.

Again we ask, did you know this?

See link to July 15th, 2013 Watchtower magazine: http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magaz ... eet-slave/

When we go back in years past, the Watchtower Society leadership repeatedly spoke out openly against putting faith in an organization, or imputing salvation to an organization. They point-blank said it was Idolatry. Take this quote for instance:

“If one renders obedient service to someone or some organization, whether willingly or under compulsion, looking up to such as possessing a position of superior rulership and great authority, then that one can Scripturally be said to be a worshiper.” (See Watchtower, September 1st, 1961 page 525.)

Also, notice this comment in years past:

“Then note what happened to these idolatrous worshipers of a man-made organization.” (See Watchtower December 1st, 1971, page 723)

Also, this comment some years ago:

“where should your faith be placed - in a religious organization or in God?” (See Watchtower January 15th, 1970 page 37).

And even this one, which occurred more recently:

“We cannot take part in any modern version of idolatry - be it worshipful gestures toward an image or symbol or the imputing of salvation to a person or an organization.” (See Watchtower November 1st, 1990 page 26.)

Can you believe they had the nerve to say all of this, and even put it in print, for the whole world to read??? Can you believe this???

Again, let's go back to that same Watchtower magazine mentioned above, where it was clearly stated in the November 15th, 1981 Watchtower, page 21:

“Come to Jehovah’s organization for salvation”.

Yes, they said this...even as incredible as it seems. But, it was surely said, in print, for the whole world to see.

Also as mentioned above, the front cover of the March 1st, 1979 Watchtower magazine did in fact boldly proclaim,

“Put Faith in a Victorious Organization!”

We are reminded, in the accompanying article repeatedly drives home the theme of the necessity of one having faith in the organization. It states:

“Faith in Jehovah’s theocratic organization... Did the remnant of spiritual Israelites and their theocratic companions, the ‘great crowd’ of Christ’s ‘other sheep,’ have such victorious faith? Yes!... Witnesses have kept their faith in Jehovah’s organization.” (p 18)

This particular article even poses the question,

“Is there any cause for us to lose faith in Jehovah’s visible organization...?”

The answer is given, “Absolutely Not!... Our unwavering faith will be rewarded with victory and the crown of life.”

So, faith in the organization itself, means assured everlasting life. Its a guarantee.

  • (Perhaps all Jehovah's Witnesses need to be reminded of what great destructive work & "wrecking work" Jehovah Himself did to "His Organization," yes the nation of Israel, such as back in 607 BCE [more accurately 587 BCE] at the hand of Nebuchadnezzar with the complete destruction of Solomon's Magnificent Temple...isn't that so? Also, what about the great destructive work Jehovah did to "His Organization," the nation of Israel again, in 70 C.E, at the hands of General Titus of the Roman Army in destroying the Temple or center of worship for His people, total destruction again to "His Organization," yes, what about at those times? -- See Micah 2:10; Jeremiah 25:29.)

Additionally, when referring to itself, the Watchtower Society makes this direct statement,

“Are they merely a man-made organization that God can use, if he chooses, or are they the visible earthly part of God’s organization? Let the facts speak!” (See May 1st, 1981, page 17.)

The writers pose the question, are we simply an organization that God can simply choose to use or not? Or, are we something more. Are not we the visible earthly part of God's organization, which of means, we are totally indispensable to God's purpose.

At this point, we are reminded of the Mosaic Law itself, the 10 Commandments, where it is clearly stated:

"You must not have any other gods against my face." [Exodus 20:3]

That commandment we remember, is clear and simple. And Jehovah God the Almighty continues by telling us why. He tells us,

"...because I Jehovah your God am a God exacting exclusive devotion..." [Exodus 20:5]

Well, it seems this organization has forgotten this fact. It seems this organization and its leadership, has clearly put those eternal principles aside, in favor their own special brand of idolatrous worship of God...'organization' style. (Isaiah 42:8)

We are reminded that more recently, with the release of the July 15th, 2013 Watchtower magazine study articles, we will now learn a most important "New Light" truth, namely that the "Faithful and Discreet" spoken of in Matt. 24:45-47, is none other than the Governing Body itself. Yes, it is "New Light" from the Watchtower Society. All of which means now, we can simply focus our attention, not just on the organization, no, no, but now we must focus our attention on its leadership and who make up such...the Governing Body. We must now, actually attribute "salvation" to a glorious organization, and to its glorious leadership too, the Governing Body.

And in the days ahead, there is more. Yes, added to that fact, we are in store for another upcoming magazine, which tells us explicitly on how we should feel about this leadership of the organization and how we should obey them, faithfully without wavering. The November 15th, 2013 Watchtower Study article will tell us:

http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magaz ... ght-dukes/
Paragraph 17

"At that time, the life-saving direction that we receive from Jehovah’s organization may not appear practical from a human standpoint. ALL OF US MUST BE READY TO OBEY ANY INSTRUCTIONS WE MAY RECEIVE, WHETHER THESE APPEAR SOUND FROM A STRATEGIC OR HUMAN STANDPOINT OR NOT. (4) Now is the time for any who may be putting their trust in secular education, material things, or human institutions to adjust their thinking. The elders must stand ready to help any who may now be wavering in their faith."

Having this attitude as described above, shows us exactly where the organization is headed. It is headed to obeying man, at all cost, irregardless of whether it is logical, reasonable or makes sense. We must obey, regardless. We must not "waver" in our faith by not being obedient to these men.

But of course, we know this is something that the bible specifically tells us NOT TO DO, when it tells us to always:

'... Offer your sacred service [to God] with the power of reason' [Romans 12:1 New World Translation]

There can be no question or doubt, with the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses controlling the contents of the Watchtower magazine, one needs no imagination to see how this special "tool" [Watchtower magazine] could be easily used to capture and manipulate the "minds and hearts" of sincere persons earth wide and eventually exact unquestioned obedience, AS WOULD A "GOD," over a period of time. -- See 2 Thessalonians 2:3, 4.

... Think about it!

Article written by Donald C. Burney

"....save both yourself and those who listen to you." -- 1 Timothy 4:16

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